Well...

[GtownRebel]

Henderson saved AK's job no doubt about it. Moody did it after Henderson left. The problem is there are no Moody's or Henderson's to save his job now. AK's style is to jack it up from outside, hence the lack of GOOD inside players and you won't get good ones when they know that the ball will be jacked up from outside most of the time. The inside guys have to get the ball and score and when you have a predominately outside shooting team, they can't get the attention they require to get to the NBA. You get the long range bombers easily because they are given the green light all the time. Saiz was a work in progress his first couple of years and is now our only big man that is consistent. The others that aren't there now but were at the beginning either had character flaws or poor evaluations made. AK has yet to send anyone to the NBA and from what I have seen, won't because of the style of play and the lack of coaching ability to increase the skills of the players he recruited. If Henderson can't make it, no one from AK's teams will. Defense is an unknown with AK's teams and apparently isn't a focal point of his coaching.

But back to your statement about giving AK 4 more years in The Pavilion - so by your statement above this one, you are basically saying that the building will bring in 5 star players. This is evidenced by his current class of 3 -4 star HS players. What evidence based on his 11 years at Ole Miss shows he has coached even 4 star recruits up into NBA players? I would like to hear this one from you since I haven't seen any one of his previous record breaking seasons to be the winningest coach in Ole Miss History make it to the next level. With the salary of $1.9 million and tickets costing like football tickets now, we should expect the same rational from a head coach to get us to at least the playoffs (NCAA Championship playoffs) and the NIT does not count regardless of making it or not because the winner is forgotten since it is not the chance to win the National Championship. Same for any sports head coach actually who is drawing down those dollars and not producing on the field. I have seen many coaches in my lifetime, both good and bad, and been coached by the same group of good and bad coaches, too, and AK, though I like him personally, falls short of being in the good group. I can point out all the flaws this team has and the excuses that many basketball fans put out that support AK; but if you go back to the previous teams, it is the same flaws over and over. The definition of insanity is repeating the same process and expecting a different result. In this case it is the men's basketball program that is repeating the same coaching techniques and expecting different results. The run and gun offense and no defense per se are old school and hardly ever win against ranked teams. Compare Duke to Ole Miss via coaching techniques and there is a drastic difference. Look at the top teams and compare them to Ole Miss and you will see the difference easily. It is not just the players that make the difference - it is the coaching strategy and the ability to make the players, regardless of their stars, better than they were when they arrived. Coach Cal does it at KY and did it at Memphis. Coach K does it year in and year out at Duke. These are just 2 of the most successful coaches in college basketball. I personally have lost interest in Ole Miss Basketball and watch the Big 10 conference since I am in Indiana now. They have some very good coaching and some poor coaching. The poor coaching results in no invitation to the NCAA playoffs and eventually dismissal from the school. The good coaching results in being seeded high in the playoffs and pay raises. I love basketball, golf, baseball and football in no particular order. I will watch those sports when I have the time, either live or on TV. I would love to see Ole Miss in the NCAA playoffs in basketball, but it won't happen in the next 4 years, repeating the same process currently deployed by this staff and HC. Something has to change and I don't see it happening with the current staff.

[rebeljim]

Who said Ole Miss doesn't care about basketball? I don't understand all these questions. It's rather simple. AK supposely has been given, and we'll deserved, to see what he can do with real facilities. It's only been opened one year, and only has one recruiting class to it. So either he gets that chance he was supposely told he has, or he doesn't. U know about his first class to the Pavilion. Seems to me he at least gets the chance to coach them to see what he can do. That supposely was the deal.And talk here was Memphis would've come after AK instead of John Pastner, but the cabbie incident prevented that.

[rebeljim]

Henderson saved AK's job no doubt about it. Moody did it after Henderson left. The problem is there are no Moody's or Henderson's to save his job now. AK's style is to jack it up from outside, hence the lack of GOOD inside players and you won't get good ones when they know that the ball will be jacked up from outside most of the time. The inside guys have to get the ball and score and when you have a predominately outside shooting team, they can't get the attention they require to get to the NBA. You get the long range bombers easily because they are given the green light all the time. Saiz was a work in progress his first couple of years and is now our only big man that is consistent. The others that aren't there now but were at the beginning either had character flaws or poor evaluations made. AK has yet to send anyone to the NBA and from what I have seen, won't because of the style of play and the lack of coaching ability to increase the skills of the players he recruited. If Henderson can't make it, no one from AK's teams will. Defense is an unknown with AK's teams and apparently isn't a focal point of his coaching.

But back to your statement about giving AK 4 more years in The Pavilion - so by your statement above this one, you are basically saying that the building will bring in 5 star players. This is evidenced by his current class of 3 -4 star HS players. What evidence based on his 11 years at Ole Miss shows he has coached even 4 star recruits up into NBA players? I would like to hear this one from you since I haven't seen any one of his previous record breaking seasons to be the winningest coach in Ole Miss History make it to the next level. With the salary of $1.9 million and tickets costing like football tickets now, we should expect the same rational from a head coach to get us to at least the playoffs (NCAA Championship playoffs) and the NIT does not count regardless of making it or not because the winner is forgotten since it is not the chance to win the National Championship. Same for any sports head coach actually who is drawing down those dollars and not producing on the field. I have seen many coaches in my lifetime, both good and bad, and been coached by the same group of good and bad coaches, too, and AK, though I like him personally, falls short of being in the good group. I can point out all the flaws this team has and the excuses that many basketball fans put out that support AK; but if you go back to the previous teams, it is the same flaws over and over. The definition of insanity is repeating the same process and expecting a different result. In this case it is the men's basketball program that is repeating the same coaching techniques and expecting different results. The run and gun offense and no defense per se are old school and hardly ever win against ranked teams. Compare Duke to Ole Miss via coaching techniques and there is a drastic difference. Look at the top teams and compare them to Ole Miss and you will see the difference easily. It is not just the players that make the difference - it is the coaching strategy and the ability to make the players, regardless of their stars, better than they were when they arrived. Coach Cal does it at KY and did it at Memphis. Coach K does it year in and year out at Duke. These are just 2 of the most successful coaches in college basketball. I personally have lost interest in Ole Miss Basketball and watch the Big 10 conference since I am in Indiana now. They have some very good coaching and some poor coaching. The poor coaching results in no invitation to the NCAA playoffs and eventually dismissal from the school. The good coaching results in being seeded high in the playoffs and pay raises. I love basketball, golf, baseball and football in no particular order. I will watch those sports when I have the time, either live or on TV. I would love to see Ole Miss in the NCAA playoffs in basketball, but it won't happen in the next 4 years, repeating the same process currently deployed by this staff and HC. Something has to change and I don't see it happening with the current staff.

Never said anything about 4 years. Doubt we ever get any 5* at Ole Miss in basketball, don't care who's the coach. AK has put about as many in the NBA as any coach we've had, which isn't saying much. T White is there now. We also have a 7 footer redshirting that may have NBA potential, also lost another big man this year to ACL injury. So we do have some big men. U don't like him, fine. I'm still pulling for him.

[rebeljim]

From a poster on scout.

Because the haters don't like to talk about the number of 20 win seasons AK has had "because the season is longer today", I won't - though in the 10 seasons prior to AK's arrival we averaged about 31 games a year - under AK it's been about 32.

So let's look at winning %. Between 1980 and AK's arrival, OM's winning % was 50.4% - if you look at that period in 5 year increments, it was over 50% in just 2 of those 5, 5 year increments and we had sub 500 records in 11 of those seasons.

AK's winning percentage at OM is 63%. His teams have never finished with a sub 500 record.

[rebeljim]

Really, the only period of success for the basketball program prior to AK was directly related to Arkansas recruiting nationally.

[lewindha]

From a poster on scout.

Because the haters don't like to talk about the number of 20 win seasons AK has had "because the season is longer today", I won't - though in the 10 seasons prior to AK's arrival we averaged about 31 games a year - under AK it's been about 32.

So let's look at winning %. Between 1980 and AK's arrival, OM's winning % was 50.4% - if you look at that period in 5 year increments, it was over 50% in just 2 of those 5, 5 year increments and we had sub 500 records in 11 of those seasons.

AK's winning percentage at OM is 63%. His teams have never finished with a sub 500 record.

If you want mediocrity, let's keep comparing AK's record against Ole Miss historically.

Instead, we should be saying, 'We want to be Duke or Kentucky or North Carolina' and strive to be that. I'm naive enough to think we could come close to those programs, but raise your expectations and shoot for it.

[lewindha]

Who said Ole Miss doesn't care about basketball? I don't understand all these questions. It's rather simple. AK supposely has been given, and we'll deserved, to see what he can do with real facilities. It's only been opened one year, and only has one recruiting class to it. So either he gets that chance he was supposely told he has, or he doesn't. U know about his first class to the Pavilion. Seems to me he at least gets the chance to coach them to see what he can do. That supposely was the deal.And talk here was Memphis would've come after AK instead of John Pastner, but the cabbie incident prevented that.

But, from your previous posts. We don't play the AAU/Shoe game. So how does the Pavilion REALLY help? It may get us the 103rd ranked player, but we'll never get top 50 or 25 players if we aren't playing the game.

So why pay AK so much if we aren't playing the game. Seems like wasted money. Hire an up can comer from D2, and just roll with it.

[55chevy]

Eleven years= two NCAA appearances. One miracle bid because of winning the SEC tournament and another by squeaking in a play in game. AK has a good non conference record BUT it is because our NC opponents are cherry picked to insure we will get close to 20 games. Jim says he deserves to be here because we built a new building when in reality he deserved to be fired after not being able to get to the good tournament in the first four or five years here. You do realize that the NCAA tournament was a 65 team field until it was opened up to 68 teams. There are 68 teams playing and we have squeaked in twice in ten years. News flash, we're not going this year either. It is now to the point that it's hit or miss on going to the NIT. If you want to really see inside the OM basketball program forget about the overall record. It is smoke and mirrors. 20 wins means absolutely nothing. Take a look at our conference record with our current coach. I think we would all agree that the SEC isn't exactly a powerhouse of a conference in basketball. Do a little research and look at the record against ranked teams. Look and see how many weeks OM has been ranked in the past eleven years. Guys here keep bringing up Henderson, Moody etc, etc. Guys, these players on average hurt their teams almost as much as they helped them. Sure, they could score. Let Burnett shoot it every time he touches it and he will score too. There are plenty of guys who can score if they shoot it enough. The thing is that is exactly what you don't want. I can guarantee that as long as we come down the floor and shoot it with little to no passing that it isn't going to work against a decent team. We play one on five most of the time on offense. The first player who catches it makes up his mind he's going to shoot it and up it goes, most of the time on a wing and a prayer. SS is our best player and we average going to him maybe half a dozen times a game. When he get's it about 90% of the time he's going to shoot it because hey, why not, everybody else does. It is so pathetic it is funny. Om basketball is irrelevant and has been for a long time. Now, I'm sure Jim will take exception and accuse me of not liking AK, he will say I like it when we lose because I can complain. He may call me a hater. What he won't do is point out where or why I'm wrong .......because I'm not. We have a ten and a half year track record to draw from. The numbers are in and they aren't pretty. We have made AK a very rich man for absolute mediocrity. This years team should have coasted to the NCAA tournament. Should have made it with ease. Once again the style of play has sealed this teams fate. Just like the rest they will slide to the finish and the only way they go to the tournament is to buy a ticket.

[rebeljim]

Couldn't read that, way too long. 55, the last 10 years is still the best 10 years WE'VE EVER HAD. And I imagine he will be our coach next year, and HE DESERVES THAT. Don't care what u think or say.

Big debate on scout about this. Someone posted this.

Since 1909:
OM has 15 total 20 win seasons.....AK has 8 of those since 2007.
OM has 2 SEC Tournament titles....AK has 1 of those since 2007.
OM has 8 NCAAT appearances......AK has 2 of those since 2007.
OM has 3 round of 32 trips..............AK has 1 of those since 2007.
OM has 13 total NIT wins................AK has 7 of those since 2007.
OM has 2 total NIT final 4 trips........AK has 2 of those since 2007.
OM has 5 NCAA tourney wins...........AK has 2 of those since 2007.

As of today AK's record in the SEC is 88/80 or .524 which is not great because the conference is weak. No other coach has a .500 record in the SEC. He has a 8/9 record in the SEC tournament. He has coached in 10 tournaments and in 5 of them we lost in the first round. Three years we went 1/1. 5 of the 8 wins we have in tournament play came in 2012 and 2013. we went 2/1 in 2012 and 3/0 in 2013. AK's over all record is 214/125 or .629.

[rebeljim]

And for u to say this team has all this talent and should be cruising into the tourney, u need to check your facts. This team has less talent than most the teams in the SEC. They out recruit us EVERY year. We are ALWAYS ranked near the bottom of the conference in recruiting EVERY year. So, if nothing else, just shows that maybe AK isn't doing such a bad job after all. Other than Saiz, what other player would start for other teams? That will hopefully change as we recruit to the new arena.

[rebeljim]

One last thing and I'll back out of here and get ready for tomorrow. As good as this class is coming in, rated the best in our history by 24/7, we are still 10th in the SEC in recruiting. That's right, 10th. So yall get off this crap where we have more talent than most in the league. Some national rankings that are being posted on scout. KY is #1, bama at 5, A&M at 14 and State at 23. Then you have FL, AK, Auburn, vandy and UGA ahead of us in the rankings. We are ranked 40 by 24/7. And this is with our best class in history. I think AK has been doing a pretty good job piecing together a team of transfers and jucos the last few years. This year may not work out. Now with the Pavilion we can get high school players that will be here 4 years, and not have to depend on transfers and jucos. First class, 3 players, all high school, one 3* and two 4*. All 3 top 300 players, 2 top 150 players, one top 100 player. Between the three signees, Ole Miss beat out Miami (FL), USC, Georgetown, Creighton and Wisconsin among others for the players in this class. And we're still in the bottom of the conference in recruiting. Yet some on here think we're getting world class talent. Unreal. See yall at the game....

[55chevy]

We will never agree, and that's fine. OM basketball will continue just as it is until changes are made. There may be glimpses of improvement from year to year but what we have will continue to be the norm. It all comes down to style of play. This team does have the talent to compete and all the pieces are there to be a decent team. What keeps it from happening is style of play. That is the frustrating thing. The talent is right there and they have no clue how to play the game. I grew up in a gym. My dad was a coach and I've been around the game all my life. Not one time in my life have I seen one person get more of a chance to succeed with no real signs of improvement. Anybody who knows anything about the game has to realize we are spinning our wheels at this point. If OM is picked to finish 10th and we muster a 8th place SEC finish it isn't really what I'd call a successful year. Oh, one last thing. You know you read every word of my long post. You couldn't help yourself.

[GtownRebel]

Jim, what is the current class ranked this recruiting season?

[rebeljim]

Jim, what is the current class ranked this recruiting season?

We are 10th in the conference, and 40th in the nation by 24/7. Saw another post on scout that said we was 43rd in the country. But I have no idea what poll that was. But even though we are having our best recruiting class, we're still ranked 10th in the conference, and 40th in the country. Yet some on here keep yelling about how great our talent is. The fact is, most teams in the SEC have more talent than us.

Here's this write up from a writer.

Ole Miss men’s basketball has announced the signing of three players to form the highest rated recruiting class in program history.

The Rebels signed three senior standouts Wednesday, including 4-star G Devontae Shuler, 3-star G Parker Stewart and 4-star F Jamarko Pickett.

Those three have the highest combined average rating in school history and give Ole Miss the No. 40 recruiting class in the nation, according to 247Sports.

View image on Twitter Follow Ole Miss Basketball ✔ @OleMissMBB The future of Ole Miss Basketball has arrived! We can't wait to see you in The Pavilion! # NextStep # HottyToddy 12:34 PM - 9 Nov 2016 47 47 Retweets 135 135 likes
Shuler is the top player in the class. He is ranked as the No. 100 player in the nation for 2017. He is the Rebels’ first signee ever from basketball powerhouse Oak Hill Academy. Ole Miss head coach Andy Kennedy was excited to bring him in.

“Ole Miss has never signed a player from Oak Hill Academy,” Kennedy said. “Coach Steve Smith has been there over 30 years and has had unprecedented national success! They won their ninth national championship last season and Devontae was a big part of that run. Steve has said many times that Devontae may be the best on-ball defender that he has ever had at Oak Hill! At 6-2, he is an explosive combo guard who we expect to have an immediate impact on our program next season.”

Between the three signees, Ole Miss beat out Miami (FL), USC, Georgetown, Creighton and Wisconsin among others for the players in this class.

MATT JENNINGS
SEC Country Staff

[rebelbear]

And for u to say this team has all this talent and should be cruising into the tourney, u need to check your facts. This team has less talent than most the teams in the SEC. They out recruit us EVERY year. We are ALWAYS ranked near the bottom of the conference in recruiting EVERY year. So, if nothing else, just shows that maybe AK isn't doing such a bad job after all. Other than Saiz, what other player would start for other teams? That will hopefully change as we recruit to the new arena.

It is unbelievable that in YEAR ELEVEN of a coach's tenure, the biggest defense of the mediocre play of his team is that it is LESS TALENTED than most other conference teams. That is not a defense, that is an indictment. Spin it how you want, but that is pitiful.